considering a mullet

[nocro]

I've got a steel hard tail that I really enjoy, but it is currently rim brake only. I'm not planning to send it back to be retrofitted for a rear disc mount.

But I'm considering going to front disc brake. My current setup: 2007 Fox F100RLC, Chris King hub on a Mavic 618 wheel. Shimano XT parallel push brakes.

I'm considering switching to: Mavic XM819($80) with a Chris King ISO disc hub($180). I'm planning on using an Avid BB7 185mm ($65). Throw some spokes in there, and it is about a $400 upgrade for materials alone.

Comments and suggestions welcome.

[jabberwocky]

I'd like to note that you can upgrade non-disc King hubs to disc versions. I've known people who had it done. They swap the guts for your hub into a new ISO disc shell. I would contact Chris King and ask what it would cost.

As for the brakes, are you unhappy with the rim brakes? Its an expensive upgrade for sure. The question is what you are looking to get out of it? Discs are definitely more powerful and fade resistant, and work better in crappy conditions. But if the rim brakes are working for you, I might save the money and maybe think about putting it towards a new bike later on down the road.

[nocro]

I'd like to note that you can upgrade non-disc King hubs to disc versions. I've known people who had it done. They swap the guts for your hub into a new ISO disc shell. I would contact Chris King and ask what it would cost.

As for the brakes, are you unhappy with the rim brakes? Its an expensive upgrade for sure. The question is what you are looking to get out of it? Discs are definitely more powerful and fade resistant, and work better in crappy conditions. But if the rim brakes are working for you, I might save the money and maybe think about putting it towards a new bike later on down the road.

I'll definitely check with Chris King about that, it would be a great way to go. I already have many more front hubs than bikes.

Yes, I'm unhappy with the braking power of my current setup. I want to be able to go faster downhill, without concern that I don't have sufficient braking power to slow down for the turn at the bottom of the hill. To put it in perspective, I've felt that way on Hoyles Mill Connector. :eek: I think part of it is my weight - not exactly a featherweight at 190 lbs. The other part is my riding style, I like to go fast.

Your point about the new bike is also a good one. But my plan is to keep the hardtail as my primary bike. When an amazing deal comes along on a used large full suspension all mountain bike, I'll probably snatch that up, too.

[jabberwocky]

I'll definitely check with Chris King about that, it would be a great way to go. I already have many more front hubs than bikes.I think Dirt converted a pair of hubs from non-disc to disk. Here is a thread (http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=196274&) I turned up on MTBR. Seems a new hub shell is in the 80 dollar range, but they might charge labor to do the swap. If you can locate someone with the King toolset you can swap it yourself pretty easily though. Definitely post up how the process goes, because I'm curious.

The cool part is you can apparently buy special caps from CK and convert your old hub shell into a salt shaker if you want. :D

Yes, I'm unhappy with the braking power of my current setup. I want to be able to go faster downhill, without concern that I don't have sufficient braking power to slow down for the turn at the bottom of the hill. To put it in perspective, I've felt that way on Hoyles Mill Connector. :eek: I think part of it is my weight - not exactly a featherweight at 190 lbs. The other part is my riding style, I like to go fast.Discs will certainly solve this problem. In the reducing velocity department, Avid mechs are about as effective as ramming a tree. I prefer the modulation of hydros, but in your case you definitely want mechs so you can use the same lever front and rear, and Avids are by far the best mechanical disc out there.

I'll note that I ran Avid mechs for a while (with speed dial levers) and was always very happy with them. With a good lever and some patience you can get very good lever feel and plenty of power. They do take semi-frequent adjusting for optimum performance though (basically dialing the red knobs in to account for pad wear). The brakes themselves are absolutely bombproof.

Your point about the new bike is also a good one. But my plan is to keep the hardtail as my primary bike. When an amazing deal comes along on a used large full suspension all mountain bike, I'll probably snatch that up, too.Go with what works. If you like that frame, I'd go ahead and upgrade the brake.

[Brizn]

With a good lever and some patience you can get very good lever feel and plenty of power. Even with a so- so lever they work well. I've been using Deore levers for a bunch of years without problem.. So with your existing lever, even sweeter.

by the way, you know crazy brizn can find you a deal. that is, i have a bb7 w/ 160 rotor i'm not using.. and the shop has a bb5 (if not, a bb7) caliper and 160 rotor that's in exc shape but used, so i could probably get it real' cheap..

[nocro]

I think Dirt converted a pair of hubs from non-disc to disk. Here is a thread (http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=196274&) I turned up on MTBR. Seems a new hub shell is in the 80 dollar range, but they might charge labor to do the swap. If you can locate someone with the King toolset you can swap it yourself pretty easily though. Definitely post up how the process goes, because I'm curious.

The cool part is you can apparently buy special caps from CK and convert your old hub shell into a salt shaker if you want. :D


I was thinking about this a little more. I will try to sell my front wheel for $100. It is in good shape, and would make a good front wheel for someone. Seems like a waste to cut a nice wheel up to convert the hub if I don't have to. The front king ISO hub is about $175. The conversion would cost me $80, and I would end up with the same thing plus a bunch of cut up spokes, a used Mavic 618 rim and a salt shaker. :) I don't know what the resale market is like for single used King rim brake wheel, but I guess I'll find out.

[nocro]

Even with a so- so lever they work well. I've been using Deore levers for a bunch of years without problem.. So with your existing lever, even sweeter.

by the way, you know crazy brizn can find you a deal. that is, i have a bb7 w/ 160 rotor i'm not using.. and the shop has a bb5 (if not, a bb7) caliper and 160 rotor that's in exc shape but used, so i could probably get it real' cheap..

So, if I get the brake with the 160 rotor, and decide I want more, can I just slap a 185 rotor on there?

I don't want to spend money I don't have to, but they don't seem so expensive:
http://www.speedgoat.com/product.asp?part=112198

[jabberwocky]

I was thinking about this a little more. I will try to sell my front wheel for $100. It is in good shape, and would make a good front wheel for someone. Seems like a waste to cut a nice wheel up to convert the hub if I don't have to. The front king ISO hub is about $175. The conversion would cost me $80, and I would end up with the same thing plus a bunch of cut up spokes, a used Mavic 618 rim and a salt shaker. :)Good call. It probably makes more sense to convert rear hubs (or pairs), because the conversion cost is the same but rear hubs cost a lot more.

So, if I get the brake with the 160 rotor, and decide I want more, can I just slap a 185 rotor on there?Yes. You'll need a new rotor and the Avid 180mm cps mounting bracket. The upgrade will probably cost 35-40 bucks for those two parts though.

[mark w]

Converting a classic front to disc is pretty pricey. Front hubs require a different axle along with the shell due to the offset for the disc. That being said (SPAM disclaimer here) I have a disc compatible King front hub in my toolbox collecting dust. It's a silver 32h ISO in near new condition. I switched to 20mm front several years ago and haven't had use for it since. It's got 0 miles on a fresh rebuild (I have the tool kit and sometimes overhaul my hubs just for fun). I'd let it go for $100 with your choice of gold or red Salsa skewer.

How big a guy are you? On a hardtail, 160mm rotors offer ample stopping power for someone up to about 190. Once you get into Clyde sized riders, the 185mm does give you a little extra ooomph in the stopping dept. The real determining factor in braking is how much traction you have (which is more a function of grip in the terrain and fork travel). Too little of either and you'll just end up locking/washing the front out under extreme braking regardless of rotor size.

[nocro]

So, I'm re-using this thread to ask this additional question.

I'm already set up with, and not planning to change from, a non-UST (Mavic 618) for my rear wheel. Does it make sense to have a UST front wheel only?

I almost never pinch flat my front wheel. I run high pressure in my tires 35+ psi, and weigh about 190lbs.

[nocro]

So, I'm re-using this thread to ask this additional question.

I'm already set up with, and not planning to change from, a non-UST (Mavic 618) for my rear wheel. Does it make sense to have a UST front wheel only?

I almost never pinch flat my front wheel. I run high pressure in my tires 35+ psi, and weigh about 190lbs.


Finally got it built up:

mullet-o-rific (http://www.crowleigh.com/coppermine/albums/new_wheel/img_0974.jpg)

[punga]

Looks good. Now, clean it up by removing those v-brake bosses unless you want to keep them on there to catch critters along the trails. ;)

p!

[Brizn]

Looks good. Now, clean it up by removing those v-brake bosses unless you want to keep them on there to catch critters along the trails. ;)

p!that's exactly what i was gonna say! funny-- he had a computer magnet on his last wheel left there from previous owner. i was always razzin him about "why don't you take that off?!" :D Mullet looks good! You'll really like the performance.

[nocro]

that's exactly what i was gonna say! funny-- he had a computer magnet on his last wheel left there from previous owner. i was always razzin him about "why don't you take that off?!" :D Mullet looks good! You'll really like the performance.


I'm a getting there. I probably have 2 days until I can ride again due to the weather.

[saxman]

How has the mullet worked out for you? Do you have front/rear modulation issues due to the differences in braking mechanisms?

I'm considering doing a similar conversion on my old Klein hardtail. When I upgrade to hydros on my squishy (I've already got a line on a set that a fellow MORE member is going to sell), that will free up the mechanical disc for mounting on the hardtail. I have a second set of disc wheels that I took the rotors off to use on the HT with slicks. I can remount the 160mm rotors and put the knobbies back on, so the only expense for me is the acquisition of the hydros, everything else "runs downhill". I can keep the Avid levers on the HT for the mechs.

I'll take the Avid 7.0 on the front of the hardtail, move that over to the SS to replace the Avid 1.0 on the front, take the front 1.0 and put it on the rear as it seems to be in better shape, and replace both levers with the mech levers off the squishy.

[shannon]

How has the mullet worked out for you? Do you have front/rear modulation issues due to the differences in braking mechanisms?

I'm considering doing a similar conversion on my old Klein hardtail. When I upgrade to hydros on my squishy (I've already got a line on a set that a fellow MORE member is going to sell), that will free up the mechanical disc for mounting on the hardtail. I have a second set of disc wheels that I took the rotors off to use on the HT with slicks. I can remount the 160mm rotors and put the knobbies back on, so the only expense for me is the acquisition of the hydros, everything else "runs downhill". I can keep the Avid levers on the HT for the mechs.

I'll take the Avid 7.0 on the front of the hardtail, move that over to the SS to replace the Avid 1.0 on the front, take the front 1.0 and put it on the rear as it seems to be in better shape, and replace both levers with the mech levers off the squishy.

That's what I run on my Karate Monkey. Since I have an avid mechanical up front the difference in feel isn't even that much.

[nocro]

How has the mullet worked out for you? Do you have front/rear modulation issues due to the differences in braking mechanisms?

I'm considering doing a similar conversion on my old Klein hardtail. When I upgrade to hydros on my squishy (I've already got a line on a set that a fellow MORE member is going to sell), that will free up the mechanical disc for mounting on the hardtail. I have a second set of disc wheels that I took the rotors off to use on the HT with slicks. I can remount the 160mm rotors and put the knobbies back on, so the only expense for me is the acquisition of the hydros, everything else "runs downhill". I can keep the Avid levers on the HT for the mechs.

I'll take the Avid 7.0 on the front of the hardtail, move that over to the SS to replace the Avid 1.0 on the front, take the front 1.0 and put it on the rear as it seems to be in better shape, and replace both levers with the mech levers off the squishy.

I would definitely do it again.