SS rear axle question

[wrench177]

Here's a question for all you SS zealots out there. I'm in the process of building up my first SS and am not sure about the rear axle and chain tensioners. Until I can build up a pair of SS specific wheels I want to use my XT/Mavic 717 wheels. I've already ordered the Gusset SS cog converter, but should I use the QR axle currently on the hub or retrofit a solid bolt-on axle? Another question, if I stick with the QR would a Spot chain tensioner work properly? One last question, has anyone used the Spot tensioner and have an opinion of it compared to say a Tugnut tensioner?

Thanks in advance,

Todd

[stevieD]

surly = heavy, spot = light
surly has inserts you can order so you can run a QR. I would image that they will work with the spot.

[riderx]

I prefer a solid axle but with a tensioner you can probably get away w/ a QR until your SS wheel build. An axle for a Shimano hub should run around $10. As far as tensioners, Redline makes a nice set that goes for around $10, much cheaper than the others. The LBS should be able to order them or you can get them online at Dan's Comp (BMX site). Anyone worried about the weight of chain tensioners, has got serious weight weenie issues! :eek:

[DKEG]

Here's a question for all you SS zealots out there. I'm in the process of building up my first SS and am not sure about the rear axle and chain tensioners. Until I can build up a pair of SS specific wheels I want to use my XT/Mavic 717 wheels. I've already ordered the Gusset SS cog converter, but should I use the QR axle currently on the hub or retrofit a solid bolt-on axle? Another question, if I stick with the QR would a Spot chain tensioner work properly? One last question, has anyone used the Spot tensioner and have an opinion of it compared to say a Tugnut tensioner?

Thanks in advance,

Todd
Todd don't you have horizonal drop outs? if so, you do not need a tensioner. i use QR on my bianchi, it works fine. I was told by several people that my rear wheel would slide but it has never slid.

[wrench177]

I do have horizontal drop outs. I thought tensioners were a good idea to have especially if you use a QR. Is this not the case? Even so, I kinda like the rocket tensioner with the built in bottle opener. You never know when one of those things will come in handy. :D

Dave, do you have a solid axle or are you running a QR? I can't remember.

[DKEG]

I do have horizontal drop outs. I thought tensioners were a good idea to have especially if you use a QR. Is this not the case? Even so, I kinda like the rocket tensioner with the built in bottle opener. You never know when one of those things will come in handy. :D

Dave, do you have a solid axle or are you running a QR? I can't remember.
Todd, you are right. I have a tensioner. I was thinking of a chain tensioner like the singulator or soulcraft. Yes I am using QR until I can figure out which hub I want for my rear wheel. D!

[hophead]

Here's a question for all you SS zealots out there. I'm in the process of building up my first SS and am not sure about the rear axle and chain tensioners. Until I can build up a pair of SS specific wheels I want to use my XT/Mavic 717 wheels. I've already ordered the Gusset SS cog converter, but should I use the QR axle currently on the hub or retrofit a solid bolt-on axle? Another question, if I stick with the QR would a Spot chain tensioner work properly? One last question, has anyone used the Spot tensioner and have an opinion of it compared to say a Tugnut tensioner?

Thanks in advance,

Todd
I prefer a bolt on rear axle on a single speed. I probably have a tensioner around if you need one. My Bianchi has two tugnutts on it and I think I have a plain uncool (no church key) type tensioner laying around in my garage. My 1x1 does not have a chain tensioner. It doesn't really need one. I've been thinking about putting one on just for the bottle opener. :D

Oh btw, the Bianchi is available tomorrow if you'd like to ride it.

[liznotter]

Oh btw, the Bianchi is available tomorrow if you'd like to ride it. A glass of 90 minute IPA says he'll be riding the Spot tomorrow...

[hophead]

A glass of 90 minute IPA says he'll be riding the Spot tomorrow...
Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.....IPA :D You're on!!

[dmofot]

Now I could be 100% wrong, but I swear I remember somebody like Sheldon Brown say that due to the lever on a QR, you can actually exert more force than just tightening a nut. This is why if you overtighten your QR you can actually bind your axle...

Then again I could have made all that up in a dream.

DT

[wrench177]

Scott, I don't know if I would take that bet if I were you. Depending on how fast UPS gets to my office will determine the Spots ridability tomorrow. The only thing I really NEED is the SS cog set for the rear. Everything else has been "provisioned" from other places. :D

I didn't order a tensioner, so; if you have one I could borrow I would be much appreciative. I'm not so sure how well the quick release will hold the rear wheel and I think the tensioner would be prudent.

Cmon UPS man/person (to be PC)!!

[hophead]

Now I could be 100% wrong, but I swear I remember somebody like Sheldon Brown say that due to the lever on a QR, you can actually exert more force than just tightening a nut. This is why if you overtighten your QR you can actually bind your axle...

Then again I could have made all that up in a dream.

DT
Dunno about that, but he did have this to say about quick releases:
Conventional wisdom is that you need a solid (nutted or "bolt-on") axle hub for fixed-gear or singlespeed use, and that a quick-release will not hold the wheel solidly enogh in a horizontal fork end. This is not true, however.
Since most newer bikes have vertical dropouts, people have gotten used to wimpy aluminum skewers, and often don't adjust them as tightly as they might. If you use a good quality (I think Shimano is the best) skewer, tightened securely, it will hold just fine.

A quick release is a considerable timesaver in switching a flip-flop wheel around, and having a QR means that you don't need to carry a big wrench to be able to replace a damaged inner tube.

-Sheldon Brown
Personally, I have had better luck with a solid axle. My road singlespeed has a quick release rear axle and is the only one that I have ever had loosen up on me.

[hophead]

Scott, I don't know if I would take that bet if I were you. Depending on how fast UPS gets to my office will determine the Spots ridability tomorrow. The only thing I really NEED is the SS cog set for the rear. Everything else has been "provisioned" from other places. :D

I didn't order a tensioner, so; if you have one I could borrow I would be much appreciative. I'm not so sure how well the quick release will hold the rear wheel and I think the tensioner would be prudent.

Cmon UPS man/person (to be PC)!!
This is quite a conundrum. I can give you a tensioner, but then I owe Liz a beer or I can withold it and I get the beer--decisions, decisions. :D

[liznotter]

This is quite a conundrum. I can give you a tensioner, but then I owe Liz a beer or I can withold it and I get the beer--decisions, decisions. :DOh, give him the tensioner and you can buy him the beer....he'll deserve if he gets that bike built up in two days.

[hophead]

Oh, give him the tensioner and you can buy him the beer....he'll deserve if he gets that bike built up in two days.
I agree. I had that frame for almost a year and didn't do anything with it. I will be truly amazed if I see it tomorrow.

[wrench177]

If I were you and if good 'ol Sheldon is correct then don't worry about the tensioner. Like I said earlier, the only thing I really need is the rear cog and that is completely dependant on UPS. However, I'd bring a few extra bucks for Liz's IPA if I were you.

[hophead]

If I were you and if good 'ol Sheldon is correct then don't worry about the tensioner. Like I said earlier, the only thing I really need is the rear cog and that is completely dependant on UPS. However, I'd bring a few extra bucks for Liz's IPA if I were you.
I think I may have some cogs laying around too. I think I may even have a few in my Jeep.

What did you use for a fork?

[wrench177]

Pulled the Reba off my KHS. I know the Spot is built for an 80mm, but, I figured I'd give it a try.

[hophead]

Yup, I've got an 18t that you are welcome to if you want it.

[hophead]

You get green dots for drinking the koolaid and building that Spot up so fast under the radar. :D

[wrench177]

Sweet........drinking the Koolaid and it's mighty fine!

[drevil]

If I were you and if good 'ol Sheldon is correct then don't worry about the tensioner. Like I said earlier, the only thing I really need is the rear cog and that is completely dependant on UPS. However, I'd bring a few extra bucks for Liz's IPA if I were you.
I like a solid bolt on axle better for horizontal dropouts. Although I can't find the link now, I've read that you can get a much higher clamping force from a bolt on axle than from a quick release skewer. That's because the QR's clamping force is divided by two (both sides of the dropout). Also, the diameter of the axle and nuts allow for a higher force to be applied (especially with the wrench).

If you are going to use a quick release, use a steel skewer (or one that has a steel gnurled insert):
'As a result of these design flaws, "boutique" skewers should not be used on frames with horizontal dropouts, nor on older forks that don't have "lawyer lips."' (http://www.sheldonbrown.com/skewers.html)

I'd recommend a chaintug on the drive side, or at least wear a cup if you plan to have any more children. :p As for recommendos, I have a Spot Rocket and a Redline. The Redline is cheaper and better because it only uses one 5mm bolt for adjustment instead of two tiny ones.

[drevil]

I also forgot to add that if you are running a QR in a horizontal dropout without a chaintug, it's a little tricky getting the wheel straight and chain taut at the same time.

Also, I wouldn't run two chaintugs if the skewer doesn't screw enough into the nut. You may end up stripping the threads on the nut if there isn't enough purchase in there.

[wrench177]

Thanks for the input. I looked into the Redline tensioner when Joe mentioned them and I must say i like the design. As you said, the single bolt as opposed to Spots two small ones seems better in my mind. Less to fuss with.

I'll probably go with the solid axle when I get my SS specific wheelset. Right now I just want to get this bike built and ride the dang thing.

[hophead]

I dug a single allen bolt tensioner out of my garage this morning. I'll bring it with me to Schaeffer tonight. I should be there by 5:30.

-Scott

[wrench177]

Excellent....thanks! I mounted the wheels and tires last night and boy she is looking good. Can't wait for everyone, especially you (hop), to see her. What the hell were you thinking letting that thing collect dust for over a year? That's just craziness.

See you all tonight

[saxman]

I have an 18T QR single-speed specific rear wheel that I purchased from Craig. I installed it on my "Mongrel" SS conversion, but the bike rejected the wheel. I couldn't get a decent chainline without it skipping, so I had to go back to the regular wheel with the washers and sprocket. (That's the problem with an SS conversion, it's not really designed for what I am trying to do with it*) You're more than welcome to give the wheel a try if you are interested.

*the Mongrel's days could be numbered as I may be able to get a ground-up SS bike a bit sooner than I thought. Stay tuned!