Clipless Pedal Advice

[saxman]

I switched back to clipless pedals after having given them up a couple of years ago. The reason I stopped riding clipless a couple years back was fear, plain and simple. I got so freaked about crashing and not being able to unclip that I began riding with fear and I'd find myself grinding to a stop even over the smallest obstacles.

I've been riding a lot this year...more than I have in many, many years. I have a lot more confidence in my bike and my ability to handle it. I also realize that I can't take my riding ability much further without clipping in. So, I took the pedals and toe clips off tonight and put the clipless pedals back on and will face my fears head-on.

My pedals are entry-level SPD compatible Ritchey Comp pedals. The problem I am having is that one side of the pedal is far easier to get in and out of than the other side. I believe that this is a spring-tension issue. Do I need to increase or decrease the tension to make the pedal easier to enter and exit? What are the advantages/disadvantages of dialing in more tension versus less tension?

I realize that I probably should get a better set of pedals (the Eggbeaters seem to be very highly recommended on this board), but I'm tapped out right now, so I have to live with the Ritcheys until I can pick up a new set.

[themonkeyman]

Clipless pedals are similar to ski-bindings (don't know if you ski or not), in that the more spring tension they have, that harder it is to release. For just beginning, I'd run the tension at the lightest it will go. That way you'll be able to get out of them fast and easily.

Actually, I have a pair of those Rithcey's you mentioned (albiet newer), and like them. Once I can track down some new cleats, I'll be swapping them out for a lighter pair of Bebops, but I've learned to ride cliplesss on them no problem.

Hope I've helped--Graham

[saxman]

Thanks for the advice!

I was out this morning riding around the neighborhood and trying out the pedals. I've got the right side pedal dialed in nicely, real easy to clip in & out. I made the adjustments to the left pedal and it seems to be working better, but still not as good as the right pedal.

[martin]

Do I need to increase or decrease the tension to make the pedal easier to enter and exit? What are the advantages/disadvantages of dialing in more tension versus less tension?

Generally, decreasing the tension will let you clip in and out easier, but it also increases the chances of accidental "clip-outs"

I would suggest finding the sweet spot where it is slightly hard to clip out - not the point where your feet are so strapped in that you have to fight the pedal to get out - If you loosen them to much you may inadvertantly snap out at the most inoportune moment - when going over a log/obstacle... That can be worse than not being able to unclip and falling over on your side when going very slow... That, by the way, will happen once in a while - even after you've used clipless for a long time...

My advice: ride around a field - preferably soft plush green grass - and spend some time dialing in the pedals - Let yourself track and see if you can get in and out quickly - if you fall over you'll land on a nice green capret and then you can dial the pedals in some more. After you've done that, go out to a trail you're very comfortable in - I wouldn't recommend your first clipless ride be the shed or gambrill...

After a few rides you'll get the hang of it and kick yourself in the butt for not riding clipless sooner. A few trail rides will also help you dial in the pedals even more - your adjustments should be minor - quarter turn at a time until you find the spot that's right for you...

Bear in mind that wear on your cleats will affect how you dial in the pedals as well - Meaning, the right cleat may have worn a bit different than the left, whcih means that both pedals may need to have slightly different tension... Also, once your ceats become worn and used you will need to adjust the tension accordingly, or, get a new set of cleats.

I've used Shimano SPDs, Scotts, Ritchie,s and times and have settled on the egg beaters as my favorite - light, four-sdied entry and excellent mud clearance - easy on the wallet to...

Hope this helps.

[bikerRob]

... I got so freaked about crashing and not being able to unclip that I began riding with fear and I'd find myself grinding to a stop even over the smallest obstacles...

...So, I took the pedals and toe clips off tonight and put the clipless pedals back on and will face my fears head-on. My pedals are entry-level SPD compatible Ritchey Comp pedals.

5/14/05 >> ..I'll second everything that Martin said. Wow! I can't believe you thought toe clips were safer.. :eek: Most of my really bad accidents came while using toe clips or Power Grips. If you have a decent set of clipless pedals that are dialed-in and you have the instinct/maneuver mastered, there is no safer way to ride...unless of course your into the North Shore kind of stuff in which case flat pedals would be your safest bet.

As for what pedals to use..(?)...Many talk about Time and Eggbeaters..I'm sure they're great pedals. Even though you seem to have your old pedals near way dialed in, I really suggest buying some better ( higher end ) pedals. Why (?)...because they will work better. Another reason..(?)..Okay, ...the two most important parts of your bike that will "save your as*.." are your brakes and your pedals. How many of us ride with cheap old style (think the old K-mart type) spring rim brakes? If you need to bail in a hurry you'll be thanking your lucky stars if you've got good pedals. Hey, ...is your as* worth the $100 for a decent set of pedals??I know mine is. ;) (note: I use the new Shimano M-540's. Sheds mud great! and sealed bearings are as smooth as silk...in and out engagements are a snap! about $90 a set.)

[jabberwocky]

I'll second the recomendation for the shimano 540s. Great pedal to learn on. They have an adjustable tension, and on the loosest setting, you can actually pull your feet straight out of the pedal if you yank on it. This is obviously not desirable in most circumstances, but for a beginner it was great, and saved me a few falls when I was starting out. As you get more comfortable with the pedal, increase the tension.

One thing I will echo is to get a good pair of pedals. I actually started on a cheaper pair of shimanos (that came with my bike). The switch to the higher-end 540's was a worthwhile improvement. They shed mud much better (and hence, are less frustrating when you get mud on your shoes), and the release pressure and angle was much more consistent. Since the overall experience was better, it helped me to overcome the initial frustration.

Even though I ride Times now, I would recommend against them for a beginner. They require a bit more effort to unclip than the shimano pedals. I have no experience with eggbeaters, other than witnessing a few people break the bearings in them.

(note: I use the new Shimano M-540's. Sheds mud great! and sealed bearings are as smooth as silk...in and out engagements are a snap! about $90 a set.)

Just wanted to add that Jenson has them for 58 bucks. The 520, which is almost the exact same pedal, is $38.

-Chris

[Vecsus]

I use the egg beaters and love them. I've never had a situation where I have been unable to get out of the pedal when I want/need to. It becomes second-nature after a few rides. I've had some over-the-bar dismounts and always got out of the pedal.

[bikerRob]

...Just wanted to add that Jenson has them (Shimano M-540's) for 58 bucks. The 520, which is almost the exact same pedal, is $38.

-Chris

5/15/05 >> ...and so they are! :D I clicked onto Jenson so fast I broke a nail.. :D
That price is limited till the 19th so start clicking. Thanks, now I can have the same pedals for my new bike...I owe you, I was gonna buy some at Beyond bikes. Their price was something like $84. Oh, one more thing...I'm sure the (lesser) 520's work just as good but the 540's have the sealed bearings. The bearings on the 520's look a lot like the old style 747's.

[saxman]

Thanks everyone for the advice and help.

I bought the Ritcheys a couple of years ago when I wanted to try clipless for the first time. I do see the point of not cheaping out on components. There was I reason I bought the bike that I did rather than getting one from Wal Mart.

I could actually whip my feet out of the toe clips really quickly. What I found was that it took me a long time to get my feet back into the clips. That's what got me thinking "Gee, I could clip in faster than this".

Hopefully either Uncle Sam or the Comptroller of Maryland will get my refund check to me soon so I can upgrade my pedals :p

[Jeep]

You may also want to put some lubrication both on your cleat and on the place where the cleat rubs on the pedal. Just a drop of chain lubricant will do the trick.

This will help you get out easier, especially if you ride in mud. I used to do that before every ride when I rode on old shimano spd's that did not clear well. Now I use Time and have no more problem.

Jeep

[saxman]

I took the bike out on the trails today. We didn't get much rain here. As dry as the trail had been on Thursday, I knew the rain would not affect the trails too badly. The roots, however, were still wet and slimy.

I did okay on Lower Magruder. I know every rock, root, hill and curve, so I could anticipate areas that may have been problematic and rode through them accordingly. Once I crossed Seneca Creek and got onto the Greenway, I crashed once and then my fear kicked in. I found myself unclipping way in advance, or walking across stream crossings that I could have attempted. Granted, I was riding alone, so I usually don't force the issue as hard as I would when I ride with someone, even so, I was definitely letting my fears control my riding instead of vice versa. Once I returned to familiar terrain, I calmed down and rode well the rest of the way home.

The funny thing was that my crashes weren't that bad. A couple of times where I would have put a foot out previously, I stayed with the bike and got myself through the trouble spots. A couple other times I was able to trackstand long enough to unclip, and yes, one or two times I managed to get out when I wanted to.

I have no problem getting in and out when the is no urgency. But, when the bike is getting ready to go over, I find that is when I get myself stuck. I'm pretty sure it is because I am trying to pull up while I am trying to unclip. My thought was to drag an old futon into the backyard, set the bike next to it, clip in and trackstand until I can unclip or topple over, whichever happens first. If I fall, I fall onto the cushion. I figure this will help in two ways: First, I will be able to improve my ability to trackstand for longer periods of time, which will buy me time to unclip, and second, I will learn how to unclip at the moment of going over in a controlled environment.

[bikerRob]

... Once I crossed Seneca Creek and got onto the Greenway, I crashed once and then my fear kicked in. I found myself unclipping way in advance, or walking across stream crossings that I could have attempted. Granted, I was riding alone, so I usually don't force the issue as hard as I would when I ride with someone, even so, I was definitely letting my fears control my riding instead of vice versa. Once I returned to familiar terrain, I calmed down and rode well the rest of the way home....The funny thing was that my crashes weren't that bad. .

5/15/05 >> Yes, the instinct to unclip doesn't necessarily happen over night. I can't remember how many crashes I had...a long time ago. It all brings back bad memories of Nashbar SPD pedals.. :rolleyes: . Some people master the technique in hours, others like me took way longer. I have one suggestion that might help speed your learning curve. Get some elbow/forearm pads...maybe even some knee/shin pads. There's a big ( psychological ) difference between taking a fall and coming away with the big hurt and coming away with just a couple scratches. Without the fear, you'll be more relaxed and your subconscious over-reactions will take a vacation. Don't worry about looking geeky. Even the experienced MTB'ers use um' from time to time. If anyone asks you about the pads, just tell um' your looking to catch some big air... :D . You should be able to get some pads at any of the on-line catalog stores. Maybe even the local sport shops might have some cheaper ones. Anyone with advise on bike pads feel free to chime in.

[Viss1]

FWIW Shimano also makes the M324, which is clipless on one side and flat on the other. I used this pedal for 2 years - it was a good transition into clipless. Of course, once your skills and comfort level improve, the single-sided setup becomes a drawback.

FWIW I was at the Bike Lane last weekend, and their pedal prices look comparable to most of the web retailers. 540's were around $87.

[saxman]

Uncle Sam heard my pleas and the refund check showed up in my mailbox today. So, I went ahead and ordered the 540s from Jenson. Of course, in the time that I waited to order them, the price went up to $65. Still, it was the best price I could find.

[jabberwocky]

5/15/05 >> ...and so they are! :D I clicked onto Jenson so fast I broke a nail.. :D
That price is limited till the 19th so start clicking. Thanks, now I can have the same pedals for my new bike...I owe you, I was gonna buy some at Beyond bikes. Their price was something like $84. Oh, one more thing...I'm sure the (lesser) 520's work just as good but the 540's have the sealed bearings. The bearings on the 520's look a lot like the old style 747's.

Ah. I was wondering what the difference between the 540 and 520 was.

No problem on the price. Jenson has this nifty feature now where whenever someone price matches anything on their site, that price is good for everyone who orders that item for a while (week or two.) Pretty handy. I now use them as a starting point when shopping for new parts. I have had good experiences ordering from Jenson in the past, so have no problem recomending them.

-Chris

[Squirrel_Girl]

I did okay on Lower Magruder. I know every rock, root, hill and curve, so I could anticipate areas that may have been problematic and rode through them accordingly. Once I crossed Seneca Creek and got onto the Greenway, I crashed once and then my fear kicked in. I found myself unclipping way in advance, or walking across stream crossings that I could have attempted. Granted, I was riding alone, so I usually don't force the issue as hard as I would when I ride with someone, even so, I was definitely letting my fears control my riding instead of vice versa. Once I returned to familiar terrain, I calmed down and rode well the rest of the way home.Been there, done that. No, am there, doing that. Last year I got Performance's "Campus" pedal. Flat on one side, and SPDs on the other. That way I could use my road shoes and see how I liked 'em. HORRIBLE. I couldn't loosen the tension properly. I couldn't clip in when I wanted, and couldn't clip out, either. I fell 5 times! at Wakefield in one night. I quit those right away. Craig convinced me to try Candy Cs. I finally started them this spring. So far, so good. Except when the bolt fell out of the cleat, I seem to come out whenever I need to. I'm beginning to actually see times when it's better than not being clipped in.

My fear factor is slowly diminishing. I'm walking more things than I should, but that's now as much because of other reasons, and not the pedals.

My advice, which I give, not because I'm expert enough that you should listen to me, but rather because I am so close to you that I *understand* is that you should just chill and walk when you want to. It must be that I've had enough mini crashes, or inadvertant dismounts <there must be an official jargon term for this> that I am slowly becoming accustomed to the fact that I actually can come out.

One final comment. Shoes make a difference. I splurged and got a "better" pair of shoes. But they are much harder to clip into. I can't tell you what makes a good pair of shoes, but they affect your riding enjoyment.

I do have to say I LOVE the futon idea. I don't think it's worth implementing, but it's a great idea.

My 2 cents :)
SG

[saxman]

I went back into my garage tonight and began tinkering with the pedals. I found that the left side pedal was dialed in with way too much spring tension. I also discovered that I had been making the adjustments backwards, that is where I thought I was loosening the tension on the top side of the pedal, I was, in fact, loosening up the bottom side. In any case, both sides were set with far too much tension. Once I began to adjust the tension correctly, I found what I think is the sweet spot without getting it so loose that my shoes will pop out. I'll have to get the bike back out on the trails and double check.

I have no intentions of giving up clipless this time around. The benefits of the clipless pedals during 99% of my riding time still outweighs the drawbacks of the 1% of the time I am crashing.

Thanks to everyone for their input and for letting me vent my feelings.

[treeskier]

Once I had a cleat nut drop out on a ride and I was unable to remove the cleat from the pedal. My shoe had to come off so I could twist it around and out of the cleat. Luckily the trailhead was near a bike shop where the guy gave me a new cleat nut.

Add a cleat and pedal check to your pre-ride safety check. If there's any wobble retighten the allen retaining nuts. Every few weeks check them for wear too.

Regards,

Dave

[jfoley]

and always carry a spare cleat and a couple of bolts in your camelbak...

Once I had a cleat nut drop out on a ride and I was unable to remove the cleat from the pedal. My shoe had to come off so I could twist it around and out of the cleat. Luckily the trailhead was near a bike shop where the guy gave me a new cleat nut.

Add a cleat and pedal check to your pre-ride safety check. If there's any wobble retighten the allen retaining nuts. Every few weeks check them for wear too.

Regards,

Dave

[MTBeers]

Performance in Tyson's had a few sets of these on sale (in the back) for $60.

[hophead]

Great advice about checking you cleats before a ride. I wish I had done so before I rode Schaeffer last Friday. I have two holes in my left shin from where my EggBeater impacted. When I got home I noticed that my left shoe was making a clanking sound with each step. The cleat was barely hanging on.

A bit of blue locktite on the threads helps too.

[saxman]

Checking the cleats work both ways. When I tried to remove the old cleats from my shoes, the allen nuts would not budge. I eventually had to drill them out. Most likely it was the mud from Little Bennett that got inside the threads. When it mud hardens, it is like concrete.

I had the bike out on one of my Dawn Patrol rides this morning. This time, I had a much easier time clipping in and out....it seemed almost too easy. However, I did not get any accidental unclippings, so I imagine the tension is set okay. I guess I have to find some rougher terrain to really check them out. Of course, I have the M540s on the way, but at least the knowledge I've gleaned from everyone here and from making adjustments to the Ritchey pedals will help me set up the 540s better.

[bikerRob]

5/15/05 >> ...The bearings on the 520's look a lot like the old style 747's.

5/19/05 >>> Doh!!What was I thinking. :rolleyes: 747's... :eek: I meant to compare it with the old style Shimano PD-M535's...#@*#@

[halfinch]

and always carry a spare cleat and a couple of bolts in your camelbak...

i keep my "old" replaced cleats for this purpose. good for getting you home in a pinch. throw the old ones in your hydrobag at time of replacement .