Anyone Drive a Surly Pugsley?

[drevil]

With all this snow, I know many of you have been lusting for one of the Surly Pugsley fat-tired behemoths like me. My Jones has the fat front tire, which is excellent when the snow conditions are right, but having a fat rear wheel also would increase the awesomeness. I'm going to try to set up a faux-fat rear setup, but I don't know if I have the clearance or equipment.

I have the Vicious Cycles fork so I can use my one Endomorph wheel on other bikes, while I built Mabagal a fat-rimmed front wheel so she can run an Endo on her bikes with a standard rigid fork. Clearance is tight, but it works:

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4039/4333559384_600fa3e77e_b.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/bikecentric/4333559384/)
(Click on pic for details)

Maybe at the Handmade Bike show at the end of the month, I'll be talking to builders about a custom dual-fatty bike, but the Surly Pugsley is dang tempting and undoubtedly cheaper. BTW, nobody tell Mabagal ;)

BTW, with the recent deep snows, the Endo was useless :)
http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4021/4335169087_b3538e2ddb_b.jpg

So does anyone local ride a Pugsley or another super-fatty tired bike? Do show pics or tell us about your setup. If you want to check out more fatty fabness, go to MTBR.com's Fat Bike forum: http://forums.mtbr.com/forumdisplay.php?f=164

[tuba_transport]

How much you gonna charge to rent it out?

[fesch]

Gary Fishers do all right too.

[tuba_transport]

BTW, what would the rim, frame, and 2 Endomorph tires cost? The rest I can put together from what I have now.

[drevil]

Pug (http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=401951) wannabes (http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=243217). Anybody have a 16" 1x1 they wanna sell me? :)

[riderx]

The Endomorph front and a studded rear tire have been the hot ticket for me this season.

Ricky = see if you can score the 1x1 = 11 with the 24 inch Large Marge rims.

What width is the Kenda on that 1x1?

[Spiff]

What width is the Kenda on that 1x1?

It's probably a 2.7 Nevegal, if it's the same tire this guy (http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=579219&highlight=Kona+Unit) is using on his Kona Unit, although you should note that he's not entirely satisfied with it. That thread on MTBR caught my eye because I have a Kona Unit. If I had a couple hundred $$$ laying around I'd love to build myself up a set of snow wheels!

[drevil]

It's probably a 2.7 Nevegal, if it's the same tire this guy (http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=579219&highlight=Kona+Unit) is using on his Kona Unit, although you should note that he's not entirely satisfied with it. That thread on MTBR caught my eye because I have a Kona Unit. If I had a couple hundred $$$ laying around I'd love to build myself up a set of snow wheels!I bought a 2.7 Nevegal to go with Mabagal's semi-fat front wheel just in case the Endo didn't work. I planned on putting it on the rear wheel, but nothing I have for the back end is very wide. WTH, I'll put it on the chubbiest rear wheel and go for it.

[markie]

If you go custom, make sure you go with someone who knows what they are doing. There was a real nice custom fat-bike last year that I lusted after until I noticed that its chainline was over an inch off....

[drevil]

The Endomorph front and a studded rear tire have been the hot ticket for me this season.

Ricky = see if you can score the 1x1 = 11 with the 24 inch Large Marge rims.

What width is the Kenda on that 1x1?
I've been looking high and low for an unloved 16" 1x1. I guess everyone loves theirs?

Where's your tire studding article again? I've done it before, but it's been so long. Speaking of studding and Endos, check out the studded Endo:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/7266070@N06/2091928761/

[drevil]

I've been looking high and low for an unloved 16" 1x1. I guess everyone loves theirs?

Where's your tire studding article again? I've done it before, but it's been so long. Speaking of studding and Endos, check out the studded Endo:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/7266070@N06/2091928761/

More Endomorph stud action:
http://mplsmtb.blogspot.com/2010/01/studded-endomorph.html

When I get a Larry (http://surlybikes.com/parts/larry_tire/), I might try it.

[drevil]

BTW, what would the rim, frame, and 2 Endomorph tires cost? The rest I can put together from what I have now.
Tube-ah, there is a guy on MTBR selling a new OFFSET fork for $55 (w/ shipping!). Great deal, until you realize you MUST use an offset built wheel for the tire to be centered in the fork blades. I've seen pre-built offset Large Marge wheels going for ~$160 each, while I've seen another fatty, the Innova Spyder, go for ~$60. So the cheapest to go for a LM fatty front would be ~$300 (added above, then guessed shipping).

[drevil]

If you go custom, make sure you go with someone who knows what they are doing. There was a real nice custom fat-bike last year that I lusted after until I noticed that its chainline was over an inch off....

Hopefully not the Retrotec (http://www.flickr.com/photos/idiolector/3318884187/in/photostream/)?! That bike was beautiful. Name names, pal! :)

[markie]

Hopefully not the Retrotec (http://www.flickr.com/photos/idiolector/3318884187/in/photostream/)?! That bike was beautiful. Name names, pal! :)

Ding ding DING!

Yeah, it was beautiful. Completely useless how it was set up, but beautiful.

The thing that puts me off of getting a snow bike is the super wide Q factor you need to get your cranks out around the big tire. Maybe your fat front, skinny rear is an OK compromise.

[washedup]

So does anyone local ride a Pugsley or another super-fatty tired bike? Do show pics or tell us about your setup. If you want to check out more fatty fabness, go to MTBR.com's Fat Bike forum: http://forums.mtbr.com/forumdisplay.php?f=164

I have a medium pug I'd be happy to let you take for a spin. It set up as a single speed and there should be some pics on this thread i posted about a recent trip... http://www.more-mtb.org/forum/showthread.php?t=17581

It handle like a school bus, but it serves a purpose. For off-road, I almost always prefer the 29er to it. Its my daily driver.

[snappster]

I had been lusting for a fatty for a while but at around $1500 from what I was seeing online, and with a $1K deal on a new 1x9 El Mariachi with 2.55" tires, I had to go for the 29er. But those Endos look so freaking cool.

[Cjones]

Ding ding DING!

Yeah, it was beautiful. Completely useless how it was set up, but beautiful.

Pretty negative post about a long-time builder with a stellar rep. Did you think to ask Curtis about the "completely useless" set up of this bike? He was probably standing a few feet away from it. I would guess there was a good explaination.

Had to check that I was on MORE and not MTBR...

[markie]

Pretty negative post about a long-time builder with a stellar rep. Did you think to ask Curtis about the "completely useless" set up of this bike? He was probably standing a few feet away from it. I would guess there was a good explaination.

Had to check that I was on MORE and not MTBR...

Someone else was talking to him about it from what I remember he said it was his bike and to paraphrase, it rode just fine.

I think of bikes as tools, and if I wanted a custom SS I would want a bike with a straight chainline. YMMV.

BTW. It does get like MTBR if someone jumps down someone else's throat for having an opinion different from their own.

[Cjones]

Someone else was talking to him about it from what I remember he said it was his bike and to paraphrase, it rode just fine.

I think of bikes as tools, and if I wanted a custom SS I would want a bike with a straight chainline. YMMV.

BTW. It does get like MTBR if someone jumps down someone else's throat for having an opinion different from their own.

That wasn't his bike, it was for a customer.

Chainline depends on alot of factors.

Jumping down your throat? Please... my post wasn't than harsh.

[riderx]

Where's your tire studding article again? Here you go: link (http://www.singlespeedoutlaw.com/main/articles/homemadestuddedtires.shtml)

[riderx]

If you are talking strictly snow, the kenda K-rad 2.5 might be a good choice on a fat rim. At 887g and $35, it looks fine for snow biking. Might have to grab some for the 1x1.

[rizetech]

That wasn't his bike, it was for a customer.

Chainline depends on alot of factors.

Jumping down your throat? Please... my post wasn't than harsh.

Really? So if the wheel is built properly and the crankset is properly assembled, and both are compatible with eachother, and supposed to be compatible with the frame, there's something we're missing that affects chainline?

Many, many things come with whacked out chainlines - that fact doesn't indicate the bike can't be ridden just fine. In fact, some of them would be worse with a correct chainline...

But, if the frame is off, the frame is off - can't really pretend it's something bad about a hub that's perfectly within tolerance, or a crankset that's properly installed, etc. - it's not longer reasonable to expect people to just get a different BB spindle to fix the issue...

Back on topic - these bikes look sweet, I want some studded endos.

[drevil]

If you are talking strictly snow, the kenda K-rad 2.5 might be a good choice on a fat rim. At 887g and $35, it looks fine for snow biking. Might have to grab some for the 1x1.

Last night I put the 26"x2.7" Kenda Nevegal on one of Mabagal's rear rims (a relatively skinny Velocity VXC). That was the stiffest and difficult MTB tire I've mounted in a long time...not to mention heaviest (weighed it at 1450 grams!) It didn't fit in two of her frames, but it does fit in my Inbred 29er, albeit a little short. I want to try it in her 1FG, but not sure I want her lugging around that much weight.

[drevil]

Really? So if the wheel is built properly and the crankset is properly assembled, and both are compatible with eachother, and supposed to be compatible with the frame, there's something we're missing that affects chainline?

The super duper fat tire interferes with the chainline if the wheel is dished "normally". If I had to guess what Markie saw, maybe the right side was pushed outward to accomodate for the fat tires, thus the right foot was farther out from center than the left?

Here's some stuff I read:
Surly Spew (http://surlybikes.com/blog/spew/spew_14_pugsley/)

Surly Kludge (http://www.reddit.com/r/bicycling/comments/9kw0k/surly_pugsley_owners_what_are_the_u ps_and_downs/.mobile)

Normal, Centered wheel in a Pugsley (http://forums.mtbr.com/showpost.php?p=1279064&postcount=9)

[drevil]

I have a medium pug I'd be happy to let you take for a spin. It set up as a single speed and there should be some pics on this thread i posted about a recent trip... http://www.more-mtb.org/forum/showthread.php?t=17581

It handle like a school bus, but it serves a purpose. For off-road, I almost always prefer the 29er to it. Its my daily driver.

Thanks Nate, esp for having it SS. I simply do not ride geared bikes. They've jumped the shark. ;):p;) In taller snow, I can see the value of (easily accessible) lower gears.

I've ridden a few Pugs before, including one time down a snowy/icy downhill on road. That was a little scary because of the Endomorphs' lack of real knobs.

Does riding the Pug in non-snowy conditions just drag? What about rock crawling like at Iceberg or EF?

[markie]

I did not mean to start a storm.

From what I remember the bike had a W.I. Freewheel and the chainline from the freewheel to crankset was quite a bit off. So that if looking from the back of the bike the chain veered way of to the right to hook up with the chainset.

A geared hub set up with a single gear might haves solved the issue (if there even was one).

I dont remember if the cranks were offset around the center of the bike. although not desirable I find that preferable to bad chainline.


I think that was the first fat tire Retrotec. If I was going to get fat(ter) I might go to someone who had made several fat bikes and new the nuances of getting a good setup. YMMV.

I wish I had left my post as being cryptic, rather than trying to remember exact details from 12 months ago.

[washedup]

Thanks Nate, esp for having it SS. I simply do not ride geared bikes. They've jumped the shark. ;):p;) In taller snow, I can see the value of (easily accessible) lower gears.


Does riding the Pug in non-snowy conditions just drag? What about rock crawling like at Iceberg or EF?

On the I-9 rear, I have 3 cogs: the 18t for commuting which is decent with the tires at around 20psi. rolls fast, but sluggish on the climbs, 20t and 21t for snowy or off-road riding. I wouldnt mind another tooth or 2 for snowy single track as the endo doesnt have much tread for out of the saddle climbing. As far as rock crawling, I havent had much luck. Flat tires, slugish geometry, and the overall weight of the pug more than make up for soft tires, which arent nearly as sticky as those on my 29er, so the tired Van Dessel is still the go to bike for tech stuff.

[Cjones]

Pretty sure this is the bike we are talkin' bout. 1st Pic from the Urban Velo guys, the other pics from the owners' site.

In the NAHBS pic it has a Rohloff 14-speed internally geared hub in the back and W.I. ENO cranks.

Curtis posts pics from the owner of this bike on his blog from time to time. He has run it in many different configurations (fat tires, 29" tires, etc.) and does lots of cool rides.

His flicker site is:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/25071533@N06/