What's busted?

[iammike]

Slowly, my ability to shift has gotten worse and worse. My derailleurs are fine, they locate the correct position no problem and seem to hold a tune pretty well... The issue is somewhere between the shifters and my cables. The shifters are original to the bike (8 years) and the cables are probably 5 or so. The smart solution is to go ahead and replace everything related to shifting, but my TV just took a crap so I'm trying to pinch pennies for the next few weeks :P

Anyway, the problem is it often takes a few hits of the shifter for it to actually pull the cable. Most often the trigger will go through full motion with no resistance. I don't know if they're just getting worse as time goes on, but they really seem to have gotten a lot worse as it got colder.

Sound like any obvious free fix? If not, just get new shifters? Or just go ahead and replace all cables and the shifters? Or just go ahead and get all of the above plus new derailleurs since mine are "ancient"?

Thanks!

[kmax]

I have the same problem with my cross bike sti shifters. Mine are just shot. They simply won't engage. Is there something I'm missing aside from the money for a new set?

[jabberwocky]

My first guess was cables, but the fact that the shifters are moving without resistance says the problem might be there. Do they only move without resistance when letting cable out, or both directions?

[mark w]

Check the screw holding the lever assembly to the pod. If it comes loose, the lever can miss engaging the ratchet teeth and you end up with the free play you describe. If that's not it, you may have missing ratchet teeth. Can you get to all the gears in the stack?

[iammike]

They only don't move when pulling cable in. 1/2 the time they work just fine...
A few screws were slightly loose... Tightened them all, will report back tomorrow (I typically notice it on the commute in, after the bike has been sitting in the garage all night getting cold).

Wish I had checked back here before placing a bid on some older, but brand new M952 pods on ebay :P

[DaveG]

Slowly, my ability to shift has gotten worse and worse. My derailleurs are fine, they locate the correct position no problem and seem to hold a tune pretty well... The issue is somewhere between the shifters and my cables. The shifters are original to the bike (8 years) and the cables are probably 5 or so. The smart solution is to go ahead and replace everything related to shifting, but my TV just took a crap so I'm trying to pinch pennies for the next few weeks :P

Anyway, the problem is it often takes a few hits of the shifter for it to actually pull the cable. Most often the trigger will go through full motion with no resistance. I don't know if they're just getting worse as time goes on, but they really seem to have gotten a lot worse as it got colder.

Sound like any obvious free fix? If not, just get new shifters? Or just go ahead and replace all cables and the shifters? Or just go ahead and get all of the above plus new derailleurs since mine are "ancient"?

Thanks!

I've had this happen on older shifters. I've had good luck w/ just spraying some WD40 inside. It's usually some old junk in the delicate teeth in the shifter mechanism.

Dave

[mark w]

Are you looking for 8spd or 9spd?

[iammike]

Are you looking for 8spd or 9spd?

9.

[The message you have entered is too short. Please lengthen your message to at least 10 characters.]

[BottomBraket]

Slowly, my ability to shift has gotten worse and worse. My derailleurs are fine, they locate the correct position no problem and seem to hold a tune pretty well... The issue is somewhere between the shifters and my cables. The shifters are original to the bike (8 years) and the cables are probably 5 or so. The smart solution is to go ahead and replace everything related to shifting, but my TV just took a crap so I'm trying to pinch pennies for the next few weeks :P

Anyway, the problem is it often takes a few hits of the shifter for it to actually pull the cable. Most often the trigger will go through full motion with no resistance. I don't know if they're just getting worse as time goes on, but they really seem to have gotten a lot worse as it got colder.

Sound like any obvious free fix? If not, just get new shifters? Or just go ahead and replace all cables and the shifters? Or just go ahead and get all of the above plus new derailleurs since mine are "ancient"?

Thanks!

Do this and replace innner and outer shift cables and your good as new.

I also posted this method here:
http://www.more-mtb.org/forum/showthread.php?t=14073

New Solution to Old Shifter Problems

OK, the solution may not be new, but it’s new to me.

The Old Shifter Problem
I’ve worked on three olds bikes lately, all more than 10 years old and likely underutilized. They all had the same index-shifter problem. They would shift from the smallest rear cog to the first few larger cogs, but then the shifter failed to catch and pull the shift cable any further. Thus, the lowest 3 to 5 gears were not engaging. Front index-shifting had similar problems, not all three rings were available.

Background
Index shifters are similar to old Swiss watches. To function properly, they utilize a series of springs, levers, gears, ratchets, pulleys, and other mechanisms.

The Investigation
Upon inspection of the shifters, I notice substantial old dry stiff decaying grease within the shifting mechanisms- springs, levers, gears, ratchets, pulleys, etc. The dry stiff grease prevented the spring from pulling the ratchet back into the gear teeth of the shifter mechanism. Thus the shift lever had nothing to pull.

The New Solution
1. Take the covers off of the shifter. This step maybe optional but I always take the covers off.
2. Remove the shifters from the handle bar. I just leave the shift cables on.
3. Soak both the front and rear shifters in your favorite solvent. I use gasoline in a coffee can, its cheap, available, and an excellent solvent. I like to let it sit overnight but 2-4 hours seems to work.
4. Use a toothbrush to dislodge any stubborn grease. Then rinse the shifters in clean solvent.
5. Let the solvent dry.
6. Lube the shifting mechanism with a very light weight lube. I use ProLink chain lube.
7. Test the shifters to ensure that the ratchet catches all available gears. If not, work the ratchet back and forth so that it moves freely. If it’s still not working, try more cleaning and lubing.
8. Installing new cables is likely optional.
9. Reassemble the shifters and go ride.

Caveat
This procedure is NOT for the faint of heart. Index shifters are extremely delicate. Permanent unrepairable shifter damage may occur during the procedure.

[Trailcreep]

I've had this happen on older shifters. I've had good luck w/ just spraying some WD40 inside. It's usually some old junk in the delicate teeth in the shifter mechanism.

Dave

I use carburetor cleaner instead of wd40, it will blast out the dirt and doesn't leave you with a greasy mess, then you can lightly lube it with something. Replace the cables and be sure to lube inside the cable housing.

[iammike]

will try carb cleaner (or brake cleaner... depending on whichever can i spot first) if the tightening of the screws didn't work followed by [maybe] a rebuild. it sounds more painful than pulling apart a car transmission, and at $50 to replace w/ all new innards, i'd rather go that route :)

[iammike]

tightened screws didn't work. will blow some cleaner in there in the am.

[BottomBraket]

I use carburetor cleaner instead of wd40, it will blast out the dirt and doesn't leave you with a greasy mess, then you can lightly lube it with something. Replace the cables and be sure to lube inside the cable housing.

Just don't use grease inside the cable housing. It's too stiff in cold weather and will cause shifting problems.

[DaveG]

I use carburetor cleaner instead of wd40, it will blast out the dirt and doesn't leave you with a greasy mess, then you can lightly lube it with something. Replace the cables and be sure to lube inside the cable housing.

Well, I needed something that would dissolve the grease. Would carb cleaner do that? I forgot to mention that I rinsed w/ alcohol afterwards to get rid of any residue. I went this route primarily because I have WD40 and Alcohol on hand :)

[rizetech]

WD-40 soaking for at least 24hrs is a miracle. Spray it all up in there, let it soak, the excess will drip out, and come out once you start working the shifter - clean with alcohol as above. Tried and true!

[nocro]

will try carb cleaner (or brake cleaner... depending on whichever can i spot first) if the tightening of the screws didn't work followed by [maybe] a rebuild. it sounds more painful than pulling apart a car transmission, and at $50 to replace w/ all new innards, i'd rather go that route :)

Buy some tri-flow, and use it for this. Also lube the cables in the housings while you're at it.

[Dirt]

Changing cables and housing every year reduces the stress on your shifters. It takes less effort to move new, clean cables through new clean housing. That reduces wear and tear. Buy some bulk housing and bulk cables. You'd be surprised how inexpensive a lifetime supply of cables/housing is.

Lots of good advice in this thread.

Good luck.

Pete

[rciracing]

Changing cables/housing often helps. I would also suggest using higher grade cable that is stainless/slick as opposed to a low grade plain galvanized cable. The cost difference will be almost triple but worth it in my opinion. Maybe split a bulk file box w/ some buddies. Same goes w/ housing. The lined housing is nicer but more expensive. I also don't recommend re-using the housing ends....they are cheap anyways.

[Dirt]

The other trick that I suggest is that cable housing cutters do not leave a completely flat end to the housing. After cutting the housing if you flatten the end on a bench grinder or with a dremmel, you'll get better and longer lasting shift performance.

You can alternatively use the dremmel cutting wheel to cut housing instead of the cable housing cutters. The end result is the same. I just got in the habbit of using the bench grinder.

Pete

[wrench177]

The advice Bottom-Bracket gave is spot on. From what you described, it does sound like the grease has become old and stiff. This WILL completely screw up the index function of your shifters.

Follow the steps outlined by BB, spraying brake or carb cleaner into the shifter body will only remove the lighter, less stubborn grease. This might be all you need, however, if you're taking the time to fix it, you might as well fix it right. If you're really concerned with opening up the shifter housing, you may want to try a less invasive approach. Soak it overnight in a strong degreaser, gas works well. Stir the can around a periodically to circulate the solvent. If you have access to a compressor, blow into the housing and try to break the stubborn grease free. Repeat this a couple times. After the solvent bath, shoot some automotive brake cleaner into the assembly. Hit it with compressed air again. Repeat this a couple times. Check the action of the shifter. If it shifts well in both directions (when dry), lube it with a moderately tenacious oil. Personally, I like TriFlow.

If doing all this does not produce clean shifting, you'll really need to open up the housing and remove the grease with solvent and a tooth brush. Honestly, it isn't all that bad. Just be careful and take your time.

Your shifters are probably fine and just need to be thoroughly cleaned. I, for one, hate buying new parts if the originals can be serviced. A little time doesn't cost a dime. :thumbsup:

[iammike]

I owe a followup!

Opened the shifters, but didn't take them apart at all. Doused 'em in brake cleaner, tapped on 'em, and then let them dry overnight. Added some Tri-Flow the next morning and they're nearly as good as new!

[rizetech]

tri-flow is king. all hail.:thumbsup: