Juicy 7 lever adjustment

[Fitz]

My Juicy 7 rear brake (2.5 years old) has had a fluid leaking problem around the lever, and the brake got real mushy lately, so I took it to my LBS (Capitol Hill Bikes). Over the course of several visits, they rebuilt the lever assembly, replacing a few parts, bled the brake and put new pads on. After the initial rebuild and bleed, the lever was still engaging too close to the handlebar (i.e., hitting my index knuckle while one-finger braking with middle finger), and the guy said it was fine (i.e., engaging in a normal position) after he finished working on it. He theorized it still have some air in the system, possibly released when the bike was hung for storage until I retrieved it, so he rebled it. It is better now, but still not perfect. The lever still engages a little closer to the handlebar than I prefer, though not close enough to touch my knuckle. He said I could adjust it maybe 4 1/2 turns max using the red star knob but that if I crank it too far I could risk popping the seal and letting air in.

My question is, is there any other way, besides the red star knob, to adjust the distance of lever engagement? Has anyone else had this problem? The mechanic seemed knowledgeable and I didn't end up paying for most of the labor because I had to come back to get it right.

[DaveG]

My question is, is there any other way, besides the red star knob, to adjust the distance of lever engagement?

Yes, bleed it correctly. Seems like there's still air in the line. Does it engage the same as the other lever?

[tuba_transport]

a whole new Juicy 7 brake is about $120 (http://www.speedgoat.com/product.asp?part=129379&cat=26&brand=16). did you already rack up that tab at the shop?

[Fitz]

Yes, bleed it correctly. Seems like there's still air in the line. Does it engage the same as the other lever?

The brake engages a trifle closer than the other lever. Then again, maybe it always has--I do recall trying to fiddle with the knob when I bought it to get it farther out, but it wasn't a problem, more of an annoying quirk that I never bothered to take up with the shop when I bought it because it didn't really affect performance. Now it's back to annoying quirk stage, so I might just let it ride, but perhaps I'll stop by for another chat.

I dropped about $100 on the lever rebuild, cleaning, bleed, pads and some other small part I can't recall. It sounded like a reasonable price to me, since buying a new set would also imply paying them to install them, so more like $200 or more. I decided to just eventually upgrade if I have another problem with the brakes, so it seemed like the best value was to keep them working for less money. I have the curiosity, but neither the experience nor time (18 month old twin boys) to learn about bleeding or installing hydraulics just now. But it's on the top of my to-do list for 2011 when they can "help" me.

[glader60]

The reach is adjusted with very small hex wrench near the pivot on the lever. I have mine adjusted way out so I can use my middle finger for braking, leaving my index finger wrapped around the bar for increased grip.

[Fitz]

The reach is adjusted with very small hex wrench near the pivot on the lever. I have mine adjusted way out so I can use my middle finger for braking, leaving my index finger wrapped around the bar for increased grip.

Thanks--I'll check it out this evening. I also use the middle finger for braking and index wrapped around the bar, so this may be my solution.

[Singletrack_Mind]

I'm not much of a mechanic, but my experience is that the rear lever has more play on the Juicy 7s than the front, presumably due to the need for greater compression due to the longer hose.

[rizetech]

just so that it's out there - rear brakes are inherently less powerful... now that we're done with the obvious - avid brakes have by far the most air-eliminating bleed procedure if done properly (the mechanic can read, and cares about doing it right) - try messing with the red knob before the reach adjustment - its purpose, as we have had 7 page debates about before, is to adjust the engagement point of the pad, not the lever reach - usually (when you bleed it it's supposed to be) the knob comes maxed out so that it engages as quickly as possible, but that may not be the case.

If adjusting the reach puts the lever in an uncomfortable spot and the red knob doesn't satisfy you, before re-bleeding it, try taking out the wheel and pushing both pads back in with something clean and not-pad-damaging (a cone wrench works well, or screwdriver cleaned with some isopropyl) - once they're all the way back in (pushing the pistons in, and hopefully resetting the seals/o-rings), put the wheel in and give it some pumps, maybe even a ride or so to see if the pads move closer in - when my juicys got too slow to engage after 2 months of biking, i just did that and boom, a few good pumps later - it's tighter than when the bike was brand new. You can also try heating up the brakes (ride up/down hills for 5 minutes while squeezing them) to loosen things up a bit, and then do the above adjustment, sometimes this has magical powers.

Bleeding is fine when it's needed, but there's a lot more to getting brakes to feel right. My money is on the above, based on my own experience, and seeing quite a few issues customers thought should be solved by bleeding turn out to be sticky pistons/o-rings (like unsatisfactory brake feel/engagement).

Cheers!

[Fitz]

So it turns out that the red knob was able to return the lever to the correct position after a little fiddling. I guess it's not automatic that the lever is maxed out after a bleed. Also, I was confused about the direction of the knob turning relative to lever position. I thought the "in" meant the pads go in, thus the lever would go out. Turns out it's the opposite--the lever goes out when the pads do. Not sure why I was confused, but there it is. It took about 5 or 6 turns to get it where I want it, and it now feels just right.

[DaveG]

So it turns out that the red knob was able to return the lever to the correct position after a little fiddling. I guess it's not automatic that the lever is maxed out after a bleed. Also, I was confused about the direction of the knob turning relative to lever position. I thought the "in" meant the pads go in, thus the lever would go out. Turns out it's the opposite--the lever goes out when the pads do. Not sure why I was confused, but there it is. It took about 5 or 6 turns to get it where I want it, and it now feels just right.

Heh; after all that it was just turning the lever. That's pretty funny :)

[Fitz]

Heh; after all that it was just turning the lever. That's pretty funny :)

Yeah, I felt kinda like an idiot. But when I took it back to the shop the first time there was definitely air in the system; even the mechanic concluded as much. So at least I wasn't an idiot twice.

[DaveG]

Yeah, I felt kinda like an idiot. But when I took it back to the shop the first time there was definitely air in the system; even the mechanic concluded as much. So at least I wasn't an idiot twice.

It's good that it was such a simple fix. I once took a bike to the bike shop because one of the pedals that I had just installed had started making this horrible creaking noise. The guy just took out his pedal wrench and tightened it about two turns; creak fixed. Now THAT was embarrassing.

[rizetech]

Just remember, that lever is why the 7s cost more (and are to me better) than the 5s!

Glad it got resolved without too much more bleeding.

[soreback]

the back on my juicy 5 has always been a lil softer/mushier feel than the front, even after a new bleed. I also dont like the pad engagment point... sorta wish theyd break so i could get 7 or something else with a pad engagment knob.